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[mpls] For your review - Issues/errors/clarifications in RFC3 036

  • From: Eric Gray <ewgray2k@netscape.net>
  • Date: Thu, 07 Oct 2004 19:26:27 -0400
  • Cc: "mpls@ietf.org \(E-mail\)" <mpls@ietf.org>
  • User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US;rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804 Netscape/7.2 (ax)
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Title:
Nick,

    Thanks for filling in the details. Please see one comment below.

Nick Weeds wrote:
Ina,

Sorry I didn't explain this clearly.

The problem arises in window cases where the upstream (U,B) and downstream
(D,A) routers happen to 
send LDP messages at the same time.  The likelihood of this is low, but it
is possible.

                !                       !
                !              /---<----! Label Mapping
                !             /         !
                !            /          !
                !           /           !
                !          /            !
                !         /             !
                !<-------/              !
                !                       !
  Label Release !---->---\              !
                !         \             !
                !          \            ! <-- ROUTE CHANGE
                !           \           !
                !            \ /---<----! Label Mapping (update)
                !             X         !
                !            / \------->!
                !           /           !
                !          /            !
                !         /             !
                !<-------/              !
                !                       !


The Label Release is initiated by the upstream router.  It is not a response
to a Label Withdraw.  For example, the upstream router might send the Label
Release because it is using conservative retention.

The downstream router sends the 2nd Label Mapping before receiving the Label
Release.  For example, a route change might cause the downstream router to
signaling a change of hop count or a change of MTU.

At the end of this sequence the downstream router has sent two Label
Mappings and received a Label Release, so it considers the label to be
released.  The upstream router has sent a Label Release and received a
subsequent Label Mapping, so it considers the label to be valid.  In most
cases the upstream router would send another Label Release, but if the route
has changed then the upstream router might install the label for
forwarding/switching use.  If so then any data sent using the label will be
dropped by the downstream router.  This isn't a transient condition, it can
continue indefinitely.

  
Not if the downstream router sends a label withdraw as an appropriate
recovery response to getting a packet with a label that is invalid.

As I said, the likelihood of this happening is low.  I believe typical LDP
usage would avoid this problem by avoiding loop detection, MTU signaling
etc.  Nevertheless, RFC 3036 allows such usage, describes hop count
behaviour that can lead to the problem, and fails to mention or prevent the
problem.

Is that clearer?

    Nick.

  
-----Original Message-----
From: Ina Minei [mailto:ina@juniper.net]
Sent: 07 October 2004 16:31
To: Nick Weeds
Cc: mpls@ietf.org (E-mail)
Subject: RE: [mpls] For your review - Issues/errors/clarifications in
RFC3 036



    Nick,

    I think I am missing something... The label release is sent by
router B in response to a label withdraw it received from router A.
A should  wait for the release before attempting to send a label map
again. In the meantime, the label is considered dead on A, and
if A wants to resurrect it, A should wait until receiving the release.

    Are you suggesting that A can resurrect the label it just killed
before waiting for the release to come?

                Thank you,

                    Ina

On Thu, 7 Oct 2004, Nick Weeds wrote:

    
Ina,

Just a couple of points on the update to RFC 3036...

First, the list of issues not addressed says that RFC 3036 
      
already says that
    
loop detection should not be used in DU mode.  I can't find 
      
this statement
    
in RFC 3036.  Which section is it in?

Second, the LDP protocol can fail if a Label Mapping 
      
crosses with a Label
    
Release.
This was raised by Kishore Tiruveedhula 
      
[tiruveedhula@avici.com] on 25th
    
August in connection with loop detection, but it is a more 
      
general problem
    
with the protocol.

The problem arises with the following sequence:
(1) Router D sends a Label Mapping
(2) Router U sends a Label Release
(3) Independently router D sends an updated Label Mapping 
      
(same FEC and
    
label, different details).

If messages (2) and (3) cross in transit then the label mapping is
programmed on U (on receipt of the updated Label Mapping) 
      
but released on D
    
(on receipt of the Label Release).  Any data sent using the 
      
label will be
    
lost.

The problem can occur whenever the downstream router sends 
      
a Label Mapping
    
message to update an existing mapping.  This is probably unusual in
practice, but RFC 3036 allows it and indeed describes it 
      
for hop count
    
changes when using independent control (see Kishore's 
      
email).  From a quick
    
check, the MTU signaling extension
(draft-ietf-mpls-ldp-mtu-extensions-03.txt) also seems to 
      
require Label
    
Mapping updates.  I am not aware of other examples, but the 
      
problem is a
    
potential trap for any LDP protocol extension.

It is unclear how to proceed on this, as potential fixes 
      
are likely to
    
require protocol changes.  Perhaps it would be sufficient 
      
to explain the
    
problem and suggest how to avoid it.

(This problem was drawn to my attention in discussions of 
      
C-bit negotiation
    
in draft-ietf-pwe3-control-protocol-xx.txt.  This 
      
negotiation takes care to
    
avoid Label Release messages in response to Label Withdraw 
      
"Wrong C-bit".
    
The protocol problem in RFC 3036 was suggested as one 
      
reason for suppressing
    
the Label Release, but there are probably other reasons too.)

    Nick.

      
-----Original Message-----
From: mpls-bounces@lists.ietf.org
[mailto:mpls-bounces@lists.ietf.org]On
Behalf Of Ina Minei
Sent: 27 September 2004 19:31
To: mpls@ietf.org
Subject: [mpls] For your review - Issues/errors/clarifications in
RFC3036



   As part of the effort to move RFC3036 to draft 
        
standard, here is an
    
annotated version of RFC3036, with the changes enclosed by ###.
There is a separate section summarizing all changes towards
the end of the
document.

   Please review the changes and send comments to the 
        
list by October
    
11th.

   At the end of this mail is a list of issues that were 
        
raised but
    
were not included in the annotated RFC (with an explanation of
why).

   Please review both the RFC changes and the list of issues not
included. Also let me know if I forgot to include any other issues
that were raised on the list.

   Many thanks to all who contributed, and in particular 
        
to Bob Thomas
    
for maintaining an extensive list of errors/issues over the years.


            Thank you,

            Ina


Issues that were raised but not included in the annotated RFC
=============================================================

- Issue: discussion on the merits/drawbacks of 
        
independent-control and
    
ordered-control
- Issue: discussion on which FECs should be advertised
Reason why not included: The above two issues are either for the
applicability doc or for the "experiences with the 
        
protocol" document.
    
- Issue:  minor optimization: if A is a stub node, i.e., 
        
only one LDP
    
session, does it really have to send a label mapping for
every FEC that
it has, or can it do it lazily, e.g., when it has a second
LDP session?
Reason why not included : It is not clear what problem 
        
this change in
    
behavior brings, and what would be the added benefit,the 
        
issue must
    
be discussed on the list first.

- Issue: the ldp loop detection mechanisms don't make sense in DU.
We should add something explicitly that
says that these TLVs should not be used in DU mode. ( This is the
current practice in all implementations that I know of )
Why not included: RFC 3036 already states this in the section
describing these TLVs, when it talks about the usage of the TLVs.

- Issue: the rfc should specifically say that  a  wildcard release
message should be sent only in response to a wildcard
withdraw message.
Reason not included: it is covered in the rules in the appendix.

- There is a long list of issues that was added to the "for future
study" area of the RFC. The list is quite long, we could probably
remove some of the items.

        
Nick Weeds
Software Developer
Network Protocols Group
Data Connection Ltd
Tel:    +44 1244 305200
Fax:    +44 1244 312422
Email:  Nick.Weeds@dataconnection.com
Web:    http://www.dataconnection.com

    

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