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RE : TR : I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tewg-interarea-mpls-te-req-00.txt

  • From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel.be
  • Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 09:42:18 +0200
  • Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, mpls@UU.NET, te-wg@ops.ietf.org, Jean Philippe Vasseur <jvasseur@cisco.com>
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hi jean-louis

thanks for the clarifications; see in-line for some hints

LE ROUX Jean-Louis FTRD/DAC/LAN wrote:

> Hi Dimitri,
> 
> Thanks a lot for these comments. See additional comments on top of JP
> comments.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> JL
> 
> 
>> -----Message d'origine----- De : Jean Philippe Vasseur
>> [mailto:jvasseur@cisco.com] Envoyé : mardi 30 mars 2004 14:36 À :
>> Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel.be Cc : LE ROUX Jean-Louis
>> FTRD/DAC/LAN; ccamp@ops.ietf.org; mpls@UU.NET Objet : Re: TR : I-D
>>  ACTION:draft-ietf-tewg-interarea-mpls-te-req-00.txt
>> 
>> 
>> Hi Dimitri,
>> 
>> Thanks for your useful comments here. See below,
>> 
>> At 02:18 PM 3/30/2004 +0200, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel.be
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> hi jl, here below several comments on this updated version of the
>>>  document:
>>> 
>>> 1) section 5.3.1 mentions:
>>> 
>>> "The solution MUST entirely preserve the concept of IGP
>>> hierarchy. In other words, flooding of TE link information across
>>> areas MUST be precluded."
>>> 
>>> section 5.3.2 mentions:
>>> 
>>> "The solution MUST also not increase IGP load which could
>>> compromise IGP scalability. In particular, a solution satisfying
>>> those requirements MUST not require for the IGP to carry some
>> 
>> unreasonable
>> 
>>> amount of extra information and MUST not unreasonably
>> 
>> increase the
>> 
>>> IGP flooding frequency."
>>> 
>>> but section 7.12 tells:
>>> 
>>> "The discovery mechanism SHOULD be applicable across multiple IGP
>>> areas, and SHOULD not
>> 
>> impact the
>> 
>>> IGP scalability, provided that IGP extensions are used for such a
>>>  discovery mechanism."
>>> 
>>> -> would it be possible to align these requirements, i get the ->
>>> impression (please confirm) that you preclude TE link information
>>> but you would allow for node information (auto-mesh) ? note also
>>> that the
>> 
>> section 7.12 doesn't
>> 
>>> tell us a lot about the expected distribution of the mesh
>> 
>> The solution MUST preclude to flood TE-related link information and
>> MUST not compromise the IGP scalability in any circumstances. That
>>  being said, IGP based mechanisms can be used for the discovery
>> which will respect the requirement mentioned above,
> 
> Basically the solution must preserve IGP hierarchy, and thus must
> preclude leaking of any TOPOLOGY related information accross areas,
> including TE link information such as carried in ISIS Extended IS
> reacheability TLV, or OSPF TE LSA Link TLV. Note that this also
> precludes leaking of any summarized/aggregated TE information, such
> that the advertisement of maximum unreserved bandwdith between an ABR
> and any end-point LSR. We will clarify that in next revision.

this would refine the above requirement (such TE link information
would be precluded in any of its form)

> In return we definitely not preclude leaking of NON TOPOLOGY related
> information such as TE node capabilities, provided that IGP
> scalability is not impacted.

more than probably, it is not within this kind of document to
provide a kind of classification of such information but the
latter would help in detailing the "discovery" concepts (see
also section 7.12) in terms of functionality that would be
required here: identity, capability & associated capability

>>> 2) section 7.3
>>> 
>>> "   In the context of this requirement document, an optimal path
>>> is defined as the shortest path across multiple areas taking into
>>>  account either the IGP or TE metric. "
>>> 
>>> are you referring here to 
>>> <http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-tewg-te-metri
>> 
>> c-igp-02.t
>> 
>>> xt>
>>> 
>>> would you clarify ?
>> 
>> Sure, we will add some text. The reason for this clarification is
>> that there are a multitude of definitions for an optimal path:
>> paths that minimize the max link utilization, call set up failure,
>> ... here we just refer to the ability to compute a shortest path
>> (using either the IGP or TE metric).
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 3) section 7.3
>>> 
>>> it is not clear for me what is behind the last part of the
>>> following sentence
>>> 
>>> "So a solution should support both mechanisms, and SHOULD allow 
>>> the operator to select by configuration, and on a
>> 
>> per-LSP basis, the
>> 
>>> required level of optimality. "
>>> 
>>> what is meant by "level of optimality" ? is it simply "optimal - 
>>> sub-optimal" or do you have something else in mind ?
>> 
>> We will clarify. The idea is that the ability to compute an end to
>> end shortest path may not be required for all inter-area TE LSPs. 
>> Hence the solution should allow the operator to select the
>> appropriate path computation method.
> 
> 
> I see your point here. Basically there are two possible approaches
> for LSP configuation -Option 1: Configure only the desired level of
> optimality: Optimal, sub-optimal, then the head-end choose the
> corresponding path computation approach. -Option 2: Configure
> directly the desired path computation method: e.g. ERO expansion or
> PCE computation
> 
> Option 1 is IMHO too generic, and a Service Provider wants to have
> direct control on the selection of the path computation method.
> 
> We will clarify that in next revision

ok

>>> 4) section 7.4
>>> 
>>> "Another example is the requirement to set up multiple TE
>> 
>> LSPs between
>> 
>>> a pair of LSRs residing in different IGP areas in case a
>> 
>> single TE
>> 
>>> LSP satisfying the set of requirements could not be found. "
>>> 
>>> why in such a case diversity would be desirable ?
>> 
>> for either path protection or load balancing while minimizing the
>> impact in case of failure.
>> 
>> 
>>> got the impression that if a single path would have been feasible
>>> it would have been selected in this case - isn't it ?
>> 
>> That being said, we need to rephrase, I agree with you that this
>> paragraph is not clear. It should read:
>> 
>> "Another example is the requirement to set up multiple TE LSPs
>> between a pair of LSRs residing in different IGP areas. For
>> instance, this would occur if TE LSP satisfying for instance the
>> bandwidth requirement could be found, hence, requiring to set up
>> multiple TE LSPs"
>> 
>> 
>>> 5) section 7.7
>>> 
>>> "This may reduce the recovery delay, but with the risk of 
>>> multiple crankbacks, and sub-optimality.  "
>>> 
>>> i agree, but this is valid iff the head-end has initially
>>> computed an end-to-end optimal path,
>> 
>> more exactly this applies to contiguous LSP. For sub-optimality
>> this applies to any kind of LSP.
>> 
>> 
>>> also unclear if you refer also here to the provisioning delay ?
> 
> 
> Actually this section is not dedicated to crankback routing as a path
> computation method,  it only addresses possible use of crankback in
> case of network failure. Thus we refer here only to the recovery
> delay. We may add a section dedicated to crankback routing in the
> next revision

i would agree to have a requirement document that includes a dedicated 
section on crankback functionality, hope the next release will clarify

>>> editorially speaking it is also a bit unclear why you've splitted
>>>  section 7.7 and section 7.8 both refers to inter-area lsp
>>> recovery
>>> 
> 
> 
> Yes you are right, both sections refer to lsp recovery Basically
> section 7.7 deals with LSP rerouting and section 7.8 is dedicated to
> Fast Reroute protection We will update as follows 7.7 LSP recovery 
> 7.7.1 LSP rerouting 7.7.2 Fast Reroute

ok

>>> 6) section 7.11
>>> 
>>> would it be possible to mention what's expected (or not expected)
>>> in terms also of hard preemption ?
>> 
>> ok
> 
> 
>> 
>>> 7) section 8.2
>>> 
>>> what's meant by stability ? ie stability of what ? (for
>> 
>> instance, as i
>> 
>>> read the document, but please correct me, stability and
>> 
>> re-optimization
>> 
>>> are imho two features that are going in somehow opposite
>> 
>> directions so a
>> 
>>> trade-off has to be found here)
>> 
>> We will clarify.
>> 
>> thanks for your comments !
>> 
>> JP.
>> 
>> 
>>> thanks in advance, - dimitri.
>>> 
>>> LE ROUX Jean-Louis FTRD/DAC/LAN wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> Hi all, Thanks in advance for your comments on this new
>>>> revision of
>> 
>> inter-area
>> 
>>>> TE requirements. Regards, JL
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line
>>>>> Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the
>>>>> Internet Traffic Engineering Working Group of the IETF.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Title           : Requirements for Inter-area MPLS Traffic
>>>> 
>>>> Engineering
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> Author(s)       : J. Le Roux, et al. Filename        :
>> 
>> draft-ietf-tewg-interarea-mpls-te-req-00.txt
>> 
>>>>> Pages           : 20 Date            : 2004-3-26
>>>>> 
>>>>> This document lists a detailed set of functional
>> 
>> requirements for the
>> 
>>>>> support of inter-area MPLS Traffic Engineering (inter-area
>> 
>> MPLS TE)
>> 
>>>>> which could serve as a guideline to develop the required set
>>>>> of protocol extensions.
>>>>> 
>>>>> A URL for this Internet-Draft is: 
>>>>> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-tewg-interar
> 
> ea-mpls-te
> 
>>>> -r
>>> 
>>> eq-00.txt
>>> 
>>> 
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>>> 
>> -- Papadimitriou Dimitri E-mail : dimitri.papadimitriou@alcatel.be 
>> E-mail : dpapadimitriou@psg.com Webpage:
>> http://psg.com/~dpapadimitriou/ Address: Fr. Wellesplein 1, B-2018
>> Antwerpen, Belgium Phone  : +32 3 240-8491
>> 
>> 
> 
> 

-- 
Papadimitriou Dimitri
E-mail : dimitri.papadimitriou@alcatel.be
E-mail : dpapadimitriou@psg.com
Webpage: http://psg.com/~dpapadimitriou/
Address: Fr. Wellesplein 1, B-2018 Antwerpen, Belgium
Phone  : +32 3 240-8491